ChelseaAdams
Ventura CA
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In a recent column, Reg brought up a discussion about the positioning of Harley-Davidson. His column starts like this:
"Harley-Davidson builds wonderfully iconic motorcycles that echo the past throughout their design. From the 45-degree V-twin, to the batwing fairing, to the heel shifter, each of these—and many more—has a direct link to what was.
This is all well and good, and I like the idea of heritage and tradition, to a point. However, I am becoming increasingly aware that Harley is—for lack of a better term—avoiding the future..."
We got a lot of response to this column in the form of e-mails, letters and even Facebook posts. Our top 28 letters are posted on www.AmericanRider.com right now (Click here to read the letters).
What do you think? Please comment on Reg's column or feel free to comment on the other letters here, too!
Click here to read Reg's full "Harley ne........t their head out of their past" column. http://www.americanrider.com/output.cfm?id=2400319
* This post was
edited 02/23/10 05:20pm by ChelseaAdams *
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dmello01
02717
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Joined: 02/24/2010
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Reg a little history first. I've owned HD and Metric bikes but my last few bikes have been HD. This year I was looking to trade in my 2005 HD ultra for another touring bike. I went to the HD dealer and looked at the new 2010 bikes and said there's really not much of a difference from my 2005 Ultra. Except now they have a single exhaust instead of a dual pipe. That was a mistake! So I happen to come across an article about the Victory CC and liked the looks of the bike. I went down and test drove the CC and was very impressed. So I ordered a 2010 Victory CC and have about 800 miles on it now. I feel I have the right to an opinion because I owned and have ridden both bikes so I know the differences.
My opinion is based on facts not conjecture. The Victory CC has more power, better handling and has many technological advantages over my Ultra. So as a bike I find it superior to my Ultra. My 2005 Ultra 5 yr extended warranty cost me about $2500.00 in 2005. The same warranty for my Victory was less than $900.00 for 5 yr. I think that shows the confidence Victory has in their bikes. What are missing are the dealer networks HD has and the owner groups.
I think Victory is doing Harley a favor and giving them a wakeup call to produce a more high tech bike if they want to compete. I switched over and I'm sure others have also.
I still have a HD Street Bob and enjoy that bike very much. Each bike has its purpose the Street Bob for around town and the Victory CC for touring.
I was both companies success, completion is good for us riders.
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Alex the Dog
Buena Vista, CO
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Joined: 10/31/2007
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Don't want to gang up on you Reg, but these letters point out the devotion most H-D owners have for their iconic rides, myself included. Yea, Ive owned many diff. brands over the 44 years I've been riding, mostly Japanese, and some have been OK--some were just junk. I looked at Harleys for 20 years before deciding to buy one (Dyna Low Rider), and really was impressed with the big improvements in quality and performance in the last several years.
What I think I like the most are the substantial improvements made each year (most are not readily visible) while still retaining the classic looks and feel of these machines. I remember how I lusted over the 60's and early 70's American muscle cars. Big motors that weren't very efficient, horrible handling characteristics, and really bad brakes. Everybody wanted one then, and still want them today.
Harleys make me feel that same way even though they are vastly more reliable today, have very efficient fuel systems and electronic controls, and the best brakes (ABS Brembos on my '08 FLHX) I've ever used. I don't give much credit to other brands using bigger motors to achieve better performance. Anybody can do that. Flashy styling: again, any idiot can do that too. Constant changes do not make things better. But there is always room for refinement, and I give H-D praise for constant improvements even if they seem too slow for some.
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HDGoose
AZ
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Joined: 03/07/2010
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I agree; the changes for HD are way too slow. Why did it take them so long for a 6 gal tank? Why so long of a 6 spd tranny; and why so long to up to 96 and 103 ci? Also; read the technical white papers on how the chain drive cam design is flawed; puts added stress on the bearings because of the same direction rotation; not to mention the tensioner goes out; and no margin for handling any additional HP mods, especially the bearings. You pay all that money for their bikes; and they cant automatically install Timken cam bearings; which cost maybe another $30? My motor blew up from a disintegrated cam bearing in my 95ci big bore with only 15K miles. That to me is unaccptable. No; I didnt beat on it either.
I really like the Victory Vision; and it seems like they have fixed the design flaws that HD has been avoiding for years. For example; why can Victory have a 106 CI real fuel injection; not through an old intake manifold like HD; 4 valves per cyl; and makes more HP and torque than a HD Screamin Eagle Ultra Classic for alost half the price? Its already oil cooled; no primary chain; no "twin cam" tensioners to go bad either.
Im glad HD now has some real competition for an American made "bagger" V Twin. Perhaps they will fix their design flaws; and change their pricing.
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Payloader
Denver, Colorado
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Maybe loose the pushrods someday, and maybe even build a new crank design with one connecting point for each piston, instead of the same one for both.
"Remember: There are no rules here -- we’re trying to accomplish something.”
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kpapa
Johnsburg N.Y.
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If everybody liked the same scoots we would all be riding RKC's
Have FUN and RIDE SAFE
Kpapa
kpapa
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Alex the Dog
Buena Vista, CO
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I can't understand all the problems some guys have had with their Harleys. I've ridden 28,000 trouble-free miles on my (stock) 08 FLHX. Some of those are very hard miles when I ride alone, but many are with momma behind me.
You will lose reliability when you push these motors hard. But if not modified and ridden sanely, they will last longer than anything else on the road (see the long term road test done recently by the German magazine Motorad. H-D beat BMW in this test, and ranked #1 in durability. Remember, this was a German test).
The Harley big-twin is like the venerable Chevy V8. Not very technologically advanced, but are none-the-less excellent motors. And Chevy is also still making them today.
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rj_story
NE PA
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Some like chocolate... some like vanilla. Isn't that why different brands are built and sold?
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MoTie
on the road
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Joined: 05/06/2010
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Ok guys. We all have different viewpoints on what is the better bikes. I've had lemons in both HD and metric. Also had great bikes in both catagories. My problem with todays bike is who holds value especially on trade ins. I sold my Harley a few years ago and got almost 75% of value on trade in. The bike I bought was a Yamaha Road Star 1700. Went to trade it in on a new on and was offered right at 31% of NADA. The bike has 16k miles, adult ridden, never laid or dropped, all sorts of aftemarket goodies, only in the shop for oil changes/inspections and garage kept. Needless to say I'm not getting a new bike and I'm having to keep it until someone buys it outright. An '05 Road Star and they want to give me $3300? That is not holding market value. Point I'm trying to make is HD at least holds market value.
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Ride_Slow2004
Northwest
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Joined: 02/02/2005
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I have been noodling around, looking at the 09's and the 10's, based on the great financing deals they are having now. KBB trade in for my bike is 8000, and that is what they are offering. Retail would be 10 to 12,000! I was trying to work a dealer down on his demo 09, with 3000.00 worth of accessories, and when I went to KBB to get the one yr old value, it had only dropped 1,000.00. Might as well sell the RK and the Ultra, and just get a 2010. Will post up a link, when I get the RK ready to go, has new tires and new battery, just needs to be detailed.
And, I will go look at the Victory, but I am really leaning towards another Ultra.
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"If people concentrated on the really important things in life, there'd be a shortage of fishing poles."
-Doug Larson
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